The 2021 Tour de France thread (spoilers!)
Last Post 07/21/2021 10:56 AM by Orange Crush. 156 Replies.
Author Messages
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/22/2021 09:54 AM
And so it begins......
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/22/2021 09:57 AM
My podium:

Pog
Carapaz
Maybe Lopez?

Green:
Sagan

Mountains:
Who knows...some GC favorite who needs to redeem himself.

Rog crashes out in the first week. Thomas flops in the mountains. MvP takes an early yellow jersey (not much of a prediction...first two days are perfect for him and he wants yellow to honor Poulidor).
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
huckleberry

Posts:699

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06/22/2021 01:15 PM
Just to mix it up... although I have a feeling that Pogacar will take it again.

Roglic
Pogacar
Thomas

Sagan

Pogacar

Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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06/22/2021 02:59 PM
Roglic (can TT and climb)
Thomas (TT on par w Roglic but not as good in mountains)
Pogacar (only 3rd in TT nationals may be a bit forthtelling)

The other jerseys don't matter.

van Aert or JA may snatch that early yellow from MVDP. Wout on hot form in nationals, Matje not so much. Oh and I saw a local guy mentioned who lives next to Mur de Bretagne and who is good at this terrain (forget his name). Too tough too call.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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06/24/2021 12:37 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 06/22/2021 09:57 AM
and he wants yellow to honor Poulidor).


Some nice photos posted today under the #mercipoupou hashtag on the insta. Looks like AF may be riding with vintage inspired purple/yellow jerseys. Oh and a nice vintage Peugeot; hope they don't use that one as support vehicle. Or maybe they should... https://sporza.be/nl/2021/06/24/alpecin-fenix-eert-raymond-poulidor-met-uniek-shirt-merci-poupou~1624553379433/
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/24/2021 02:16 PM
A-F knocked the ball out of the park with those kits....UNTIL THEY SAID THEY WERE FOR TEAM PRESENTATION ONLY!!

Seriously...WTF? pay the damn UCI fine and rock those things for at least the first weekend!!

Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Dale

Posts:1494

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06/25/2021 01:34 PM
If it wasn’t 20 euros to ship a 30 euro tee shirt I’d get one in black… maybe a jersey as well. Those are sweet! Totally agree, pay the fine and roll out in those kits. Super Mario garnered way more publicity than his team paid in fines.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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06/25/2021 08:16 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 06/24/2021 02:16 PM
A-F knocked the ball out of the park with those kits....UNTIL THEY SAID THEY WERE FOR TEAM PRESENTATION ONLY!!

Seriously...WTF? pay the damn UCI fine and rock those things for at least the first weekend!!



Saw that and agree completely!  The first photo of CyclingNews' story of Van der Poel sitti on the Peugeot hood - wow!  He looks like a young/future true hard man in the honored tradition.

https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/6mp5PCojdLrRvzHHKi43AP-970-80.jpg.webp  (Have no idea how to deal with the .jpg.webp)
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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06/25/2021 09:41 PM
Great fun to feel the retro vibe here. Those riders need some Vit. D supplements, just sayin. And this old codger can see the difference between wool and lycra. My loss, I guess. Let them race and have some fun!
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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06/25/2021 09:51 PM
Great fun to feel the retro vibe here. Those so pale riders need some Vit. D supplements, just sayin. Or if you are a medical history nerd like me look to 1918, Also this old codger can see the difference between wool and lycra, perhaps my loss. Whatever, let them race and sell some tickets, as we all know this is legit race and at the same time least as much a show.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/26/2021 06:52 AM
Alpecin-Fenix asked for and received permission to wear the new kit in the race…excellent.

Peacock has the commercial-free feed…and also an Uncle Phil / Bobke-free feed as well!!
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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06/26/2021 09:27 AM
Crazy crash due to idiotic supporter, welcome to tour.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/26/2021 10:16 AM
Great win for Allaphillipe…I always thought that final climb was going to be a bit too much for MVP.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Dale

Posts:1494

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06/26/2021 11:00 AM
Surprised there were only three DNF. I wonder if they’ll be a few DNS tomorrow. Those were a couple of nasty pileups.

A well earned win by JA, he was set up nicely and drilled it.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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06/26/2021 12:14 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 06/26/2021 10:16 AM
Great win for Allaphillipe…I always thought that final climb was going to be a bit too much for MVP.


VDP himself rated it as too hard earlier this week and tomorrow is even more difficult. His eyes supposedly are on some stages later this week.
huckleberry

Posts:699

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06/26/2021 01:08 PM
Thanks CK!

After suffering through the NBCsn feed with the massive amounts of commercials and blabbering of Bob and Phil, I paid the $4.99 for a month of Peacock. Plus I can now catch up with Ray Donovan ; )
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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06/26/2021 05:09 PM
Yeah, JA started this Tour off on a good note. Now if we could only bring the early Tour crashes down by a (say) factor of 3.
longslowdistance

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06/26/2021 10:55 PM
Sagan was on the ground for quite a while. Any word on how he's doing?
zootracer

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06/27/2021 12:32 AM
that fan needs to be skewered...
zootracer

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06/27/2021 08:25 AM
French police are looking for the suspect that was holding the sign. It was a woman.
79pmooney

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06/27/2021 11:18 AM
I read an opinion on Bike Forums that the French should enact a law that anyone interfering with a race pay 3X the damages. Also that fellow spectators who tackle and pull back those who interfere be protected by law. I think itshould go further. Those who do not do their best to corral that spectator be considered accessories.

Edit:  Discovery: when  we go to a new page, we lose that 3 acre formatting!  I'm back to eliminate the returns to make my post readable.
Orange Crush

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06/27/2021 11:32 AM
Stage 2 was huge in so many ways.
79pmooney

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06/27/2021 12:01 PM
Posted By Orange Crush on 06/27/2021 11:32 AM
Stage 2 was huge in so many ways.
Not the least of which is Nairo Quintana leading Carl Sagan in the race for the green jersey.  (2 points to none.)    After 2 stages where Sagan was supposed to be distancing the sprinters.

And seriously - did Sagan suffer injuries ysterday?

Orange Crush

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06/27/2021 12:34 PM
Of course big brother Peter has 18 points:-)
huckleberry

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06/27/2021 01:11 PM
Wow... Just wow.
Nick A

Posts:623

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06/27/2021 03:28 PM
Back to the riders. Clearly just there to be seen. Didn't do the "sea parting" thing, as is expected. Just selfish, stupid, and generally effed up in so many ways.
huckleberry

Posts:699

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06/28/2021 09:41 AM
Simon Gerrans has a voice best suited for torture.

79pmooney

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06/28/2021 10:12 AM
Van der Poel. CyclingNews today has a write-up on his yellow bike. Talks of how he missed his dream of winning Stage 1 in honor of his grandfather. To make up for it, all he had to do was take the full 18 points at the two final climbs of Mûr-de-Bretagne and finish with a gap.

In honor of his grandfather, the bike wears the message "Allez PouPou. 14 Tours, 7 stage wins, 3 second and 5 third steps. Yellow was not meant to be till now. Allez Mathieu."
Dale

Posts:1494

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06/28/2021 10:38 AM
Well that was ugly. Another $100,000 in bike gear headed for the dumpster today and 50 grand for Tegaderm.
Orange Crush

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06/28/2021 10:40 AM
Absolute carnage and a lot of favorites have hit the deck.
zootracer

Posts:788

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06/28/2021 11:00 AM
Rumor has it that the French are debating about changing the title of "The Tour De France" to "Derby De Demolition".
79pmooney

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06/28/2021 01:16 PM
The Tour de France. Brought to you by the inventors of the guillotine and promoters of jousting.
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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06/28/2021 01:55 PM
Ewan taking down Sagan was a big gift to Alaphillipe’s green jersey run.
6ix

Posts:415

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06/28/2021 03:20 PM
In all seriousness, when do you think key sprinters will start strapping on some G-Form body armor before the final 20km when it's expected to end in a sprint finish?

It's not really a bad idea. For those not taking part in the potential carnage, just soft-pedal in the final 3 or 5km. Stay out of trouble.

Can't imagine how much skin Caleb lost during that LONG slide. Ugh.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/28/2021 04:25 PM
Can't imagine how much skin Caleb lost during that LONG slide. Ugh.


Looks like he had a base layer on, which helped reduce the road rash he got....but it is still pretty damn nasty. But based on that slide, I was expecting much worse.

Unfortunately, the GC is almost all but done now....no way Rog can make up a minute on Pog, especially given how he landed on his ass. Carapaz can't TT with the likes of Pog and can't drop him in the mountains.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/28/2021 04:27 PM
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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06/28/2021 04:47 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 06/28/2021 04:27 PM
Doesn't compute.  (I just see a broken link.)

Ewan - I wish him an acre of road rash.  (Less, like the lot of my domicile and some of it's gonna be very deep.)

zootracer

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06/28/2021 04:48 PM
What is the update on Ewan? It looked bad....
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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06/28/2021 04:57 PM
Posted By ed custer on 06/28/2021 04:48 PM
What is the update on Ewan? It looked bad....


Collarbone. Same for Gesink earlier.
mondonico

Posts:137

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06/28/2021 07:13 PM
I don't know how anyone can say this tour is over. Based on the first three days alone things could just hit the crapper again and again. There might be someone we never would thought of come to the front in a week or two.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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06/28/2021 07:17 PM
Posted By Orange Crush on 06/28/2021 04:57 PM
Posted By ed custer on 06/28/2021 04:48 PM
What is the update on Ewan? It looked bad....


Collarbone. Same for Gesink earlier.

Collarbone - no big deal.  (But better if you drive to your job and do office work.)  That said, it took me 4 to get my symmetry back.

Edit:  I see I"m the thread page turner.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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06/29/2021 09:25 AM
Based on the first three days alone things could just hit the crapper again and again.


Sure, things could go pear-shaped for Pog....but it would have to be a crash or something catastrophic. Leaving that to the side, I don't see anyone coming close to him now.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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06/29/2021 10:36 AM
Well, we got the feel good story today. Cav sitting on the road in tears after winning his 31st stage; after 5 years and thinking he was never seeing the Tour again. Now getting to benefit from one of the best teams ever at winning single day races and stages. Getting to benefit from stars lining up. (I don't know what's happening between Sam Bennett and Lefevre but its a blessing for Cav and he's stepped up to it.)

Best part (IMO): doing this as a fairly modest, likable guy. Who'd a thunk anyone would ever say that about Mark Cavendish?
Cosmic Kid

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06/29/2021 10:42 AM
I didn't rate Cav's chances for a stage win, so well done in him proving the doubters wrong.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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06/29/2021 11:06 AM
Instant karma for Cavendish. He made a point of stopping to check on Ewan yesterday before crossing the line. Major props for what seemed like an impossible comeback.
huckleberry

Posts:699

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06/29/2021 11:26 AM
Agreed, 79pmooney -

I never really cared for Cavendish until recently. I love seeing someone appreciate the opportunities they've been given. Showing concern for Ewan yesterday, and his post-race reaction today was gold.
Dale

Posts:1494

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06/29/2021 12:49 PM
I figured Cav would be an also ran in a few flat stages but wouldn’t have bet on him to win.

Well done.
mondonico

Posts:137

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06/29/2021 01:32 PM
In a sport that we all have enjoyed since we could walk. A sport that can grant someones wishes and break anothers heart in minutes. This years Tour has done that again in the first four stages. Two rookie stage winners and one in yellow. A polkadot jersey winner who not many heard of before in his first Tour and now one of the greats who many thought was done. Can't wait to see what happens the rest of the way.
6ix

Posts:415

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06/29/2021 03:07 PM
Don't mind me, I'm just eating my hat. One bite at a time.
zootracer

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06/29/2021 08:45 PM
You have to admit that was pretty special when Cav took the sprint. Also all the riders congratulating him. from different teams. I don't recall a rider ever being that emotional. He must have cried for ten minutes. Good for him....
longslowdistance

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06/29/2021 09:22 PM
Loved that hard pull by JA, completely sacrificing himself. Real teammates.
Orange Crush

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06/29/2021 09:52 PM
Zoot you must have missed stage 2. VDP broke up pretty hard when thinking about his grandpa. Those two were super close.
Orange Crush

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06/29/2021 09:57 PM
Posted By Evan Solida on 06/29/2021 03:07 PM
Don't mind me, I'm just eating my hat. One bite at a time.


When he won in Belgium against a strong field I knew he had it in him to win again on biggest stage. LSD - yes always great to see teamwork like JA and VDP are putting in.
longslowdistance

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06/30/2021 07:27 AM
All time most Tour stage wins: 1. Merckx: 34 Cav: 31

I didn’t realize far how up the list he was.
zootracer

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06/30/2021 09:03 AM
French police arrested woman who caused massive crash during stage 1......
Orange Crush

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06/30/2021 09:39 AM
VDP got some of those fancy TT wheels Ineos is riding. Credit card payment by AF made to Ineos. Roglic did a fine iTT for his injuries just off Kung.
79pmooney

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06/30/2021 10:22 AM
I see the infamous sign holder has been caught. Now prosecuting this won't be straightforward. Defense will argue that an impartial jury cannot be found, at least not within the borders of France (and probably all of Europe - Ben). Rumors are that there is a monastery high in Tibet that doesn't get satellite coverage. They'll have to decide which is more feasible, bring the monks half way around the world and providing appropriate quarters for them or bring the trial to them (which has the advantage of thinning the potentially hostile crowds a little).
Orange Crush

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06/30/2021 11:15 AM
This is not something that requires a jury Ben. It is just for a judge to rule on the evidence and nature of the charge.
79pmooney

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06/30/2021 11:55 AM
Posted By Orange Crush on 06/30/2021 11:15 AM
This is not something that requires a jury Ben. It is just for a judge to rule on the evidence and nature of the charge.

You are taking me way too seriously!
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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06/30/2021 11:57 AM
And to the race today: winners - Pogacar and Van der Poel. I like. Van Aert did well but just holding serve with Van der Poel means the jersey stays put. I hoped better from Alaphilippe but yesterday's sacrifice for Cavendish might have taken its toll.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/01/2021 09:44 AM
French police arrested woman who caused massive crash during stage 1......


Insane....she is an idiot, not a criminal.

(Update-ASO is not pressing charges and she is to be released)

Whether she will eventually be sued remains to be seen....but if it ASO that sues her, good freakin' luck. If I am her attorney, I am just playing clips of worse behavior that has been going on for years w/o a peep from ASO. The reality is that they have been tacitly endorsing this behavior for decades because it is good for TV viewers to see lots of people on the roadside.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
zootracer

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07/01/2021 10:32 AM
They dropped lawsuit. She could be prosecuted criminally. Probably not...note she has not been named.
79pmooney

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07/01/2021 10:51 AM
Cav, D-QS, one hell of a late pull from Alaphilippe. We've seen it before but still a good show.
Dale

Posts:1494

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07/01/2021 12:46 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 07/01/2021 09:44 AM
...if it ASO that sues her, good freakin' luck. If I am her attorney, I am just playing clips of worse behavior that has been going on for years w/o a peep from ASO. The reality is that they have been tacitly endorsing this behavior for decades because it is good for TV viewers to see lots of people on the roadside.


I said the same thing to some buddies. The other evidence I'd trot out would be the wrecks caused by poorly placed barriers, tight chicanes on narrow roads, and downhill finishes that have all led to missive pileups. This years wrecks alone would get any legal action against her dismissed.
Cosmic Kid

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07/01/2021 12:55 PM
They dropped lawsuit. She could be prosecuted criminally.


No, it is vice-versa....criminal charges have been dropped but she is still subject to civil cases, either by the ASO or individual riders.

That was a full-on gallop today....can only tip my hat to Cav (and continue to chew on the shoe in my mouth).
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/01/2021 03:06 PM
Revision of my earlier post:
Ewan taking himself and Sagan out is a big boost to Cav’s (not Alaphilliipe’s) green jersey run. Wow.
zootracer

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07/01/2021 03:08 PM
c.k. it's all over the internet. The Tour De France withdrew the lawsuit. She can be fined for causing the crash....
79pmooney

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07/01/2021 05:36 PM
zoot, ASO chose to withdraw the lawsuit. Soler and others still might go ahead.
Dale

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07/02/2021 09:48 AM
Stage 7.... (insert jaw dropping emoji here)

79pmooney

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07/02/2021 11:29 AM
Posted By Dale Dale on 07/02/2021 09:48 AM
Stage 7.... (insert jaw dropping emoji here)


I saw that break with so many names in it go and thought "this is going to be a very long day for a whole bunch of domestiques".  A "why did I pick this profession?" kind of day.  A quiet dinner table tonight.

Van Aert and Van der Poel are gifts to today's racing.  They come to play.  So far from 3-week Skybots!  I'd love to see JA up there with them but between tomorrow's mountains and the pulls he's done for his teammate, I'll give him a pass.

As I see it, winners today - Nibali and Thomas.  (Thomas,"st" - same time - for not doing a whole lot in today's crazy race; pretty close to priceless.)  Losers - Roglic obviously and Carapaz; a whole lotta work for nothing.  I'm guessing Capapaz can hold his own tomorrow but he really needs to shine when the opportunity is there.

Edit: funny, I was thinking as I made coffee before firing up the computer that the this week tours, the TdF, is the physically hardest regularly scheduled athletic event on the planet and recalled seeing the bare chested Greg Lemond after his win looking emancipated.  Then, but the domestiques don't have it so bad.  They have their hard moments and hours but also get some not so hard days.  (Well there are the Tony Martins and Tim Declercqs of the peloton.)

Get on-line and watch this!  A break with the Vans, Nibali, Yates, Asgreen ...  The GC front runner not on a team that can Postal/Sky pull the peloton forever.  Didn't matter where you were in the peoloton.  As soon as you saw that break go, you knew today is not going to be fun.  But for us fans?  Gold!  Real bike racing!
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/02/2021 05:35 PM
I don’t see Nibali as a winner today…actually the opposite. He went for a stage win and didn’t even come close and he’ll lose massive time tomorrow. He was never a GC contender in this race.

But damn what a great stage…full on racing across the board. For the stage, for the (temporary) yellow jersey and for the GC.

Carapaz burned a bunch of marches and got nothing for it….Pog played it smart, kept his cool and let the race play out. Very mature racing.

JV needs to pull Rog and get him set for a Vuelta defense. There is nothing to be gained from keeping him in the Tour now. Better a Vuelta win than maybe a Tour stage later in the race. And with this weekend’s courses, he is just gonna dig himself into a deeper hole.

More stages like this, please!!!
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/02/2021 06:49 PM
Nibali didn’t go for a stage win. He didn’t figure his odds to be very good but when a big group went he talked himself into joining. Not sure what he is hoping to get out of this tour, he seems a little lost. As is Yates.

Pog got lucky that Movistar still carries a grudge on Carapaz. They messed up letting a big group get that far away and made life unnecessary hard on themselves. In the end UAE were burned but Movistar picked up the slack. https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-de-france-favourite-pogacar-says-29-rider-break-was-really-unlucky/

Agreed on Roglic. JV still has options. Roglic isn’t one of them.

Van Aert wanted to go for yellow but could not drop VDP. VDP joined to protect yellow and just to make things less boring. Mission accomplished.
Cosmic Kid

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07/02/2021 08:39 PM
Pog got lucky that Movistar still carries a grudge on Carapaz.


Oh, agreed 100%. But he was still smart to not overreact and see how the race played out.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/02/2021 08:44 PM
I surely was entertained. WvA and VDP in full beast mode made for quite a show. And an excellent ride by the winner.
Very curious how efforts expended today will play out going forward.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/02/2021 11:00 PM
No matter the outcome has been one of the best Tours to watch in a long time. A very much changing of the guard for cycling going forward.
longslowdistance

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07/03/2021 06:22 AM
Yes! Except for Cav (so far)! But still his success is more of the unexpected.
Orange Crush

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07/03/2021 10:26 AM
Stamp of authority. Now what for final 13 days?

Good day for Bahrain. Stage, polka, combativity.

VDP can refocus on Olympics.
79pmooney

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07/03/2021 10:42 AM
Posted By 79 pmooney on 07/02/2021 11:29 AM ...

As I see it, winners today - Nibali and Thomas.  (Thomas,"st" - same time - for not doing a whole lot in today's crazy race; pretty close to priceless.)  Losers - Roglic obviously and Carapaz; a whole lotta work for nothing.  I'm guessing Carapaz can hold his own tomorrow but he really needs to shine when the opportunity is there.

...

Well my prediction for Carapaz came true.  On another day, his ride today would have gotten him by.
longslowdistance

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07/03/2021 10:56 AM
Best Tour in many years.
Cosmic Kid

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07/03/2021 12:33 PM
Welp….what are we gonna do for 2 weeks now?

Like I said before…best defense is a good offense. Pog can just cruise for 2 weeks.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
huckleberry

Posts:699

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07/03/2021 02:02 PM
Maybe best first week of a Tour, but from now on the odds are it may be a snoozer for GC...
Orange Crush

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07/03/2021 03:29 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 07/03/2021 12:33 PM
Welp….what are we gonna do for 2 weeks now?

Like I said before…best defense is a good offense. Pog can just cruise for 2 weeks.


The early crashes have both been a curse and a blessing. The curse part is we lost a lot of podium candidates. The blessing part is no team is able to control the race which leads to a lot more attacking riding. If JV, Movistar and Ineos are still at full strength today, you won't see a Pogacar attack from that far out, or massive escape like we had yesterday. The lack of control can make the next two weeks quite interesting still.

Gotta feel for van Aert. That yellow was so tantalizingly close all week and now it is gone.
huckleberry

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07/03/2021 04:57 PM
"The lack of control can make the next two weeks quite interesting still." OC

I really hope so.
longslowdistance

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07/03/2021 10:01 PM
So yesterday we saw a smack down, but what was left in the tank? Today we saw a smack down by a different rider, but what is left in his tank? Punches, counter punches, epic solos, and no robots. Great stuff this year!
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/03/2021 11:09 PM
I think the last two weeks will not be the same team train riding the front. UAE does not seem to be that type of team. And wanting to keeping their climbers fresh. I'm finally looking forward to an attacking type race where lots of riders will go for stage wins and a few GC wannabes go from distance for a chance to get on the podium. Maybe just infusing the race. Would love to see the race spread all over the course as it has been most of the week.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/04/2021 11:10 AM
Posted By 79 pmooney on 07/04/2021 11:10 AM
Another day of ho-hum racing. Not! O'Conner opened my eyes (and I'm guessing a few others'). Fun seeing Quintana making others hurt on descents! Pogacar - what can you say.

Tough seeing Roglic out but given how his Tour had gone, nothing else made sense. Van der Poel leaving doesn't bother me. He did a lot the past week for great racing to watch, did some really hard riding, but riding today, losing a ton of time - what would that accomplish? (I won't watch the Olympic MTB but I will root for him!)

And off topic, but the other multi-discipline all-arounder won again. Win number 29! Giro Donne; Marianne Vos. Putting in a special ride in memory of fella crosser Jolien Verschueren who passed at 31 of brain cancer. Thought of Marty (forget his username) of the old VN forum who passed of the same around 2008.

Edit: Demare missed the time cut.  The gruppetto and Cavendish made it. Cavendish was seen hugging his teammates after the finish.  CyclingNews's Patrick Fletcher commented that making the cut sometimes rates as the great story no one sees.  I thought just that when Cavendish came off on the first big climb.  That if he really wanted that green jersey, today was going to be a very long day.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/04/2021 06:11 PM
UAE is only going to ride to protect Pog. They have no interest, nor the riders, to control the field every day. So in that sense, the racing will be open, but the top spot is secured ( obviously)

The battle for the Top 10 will be interesting…not as entertaining as a GC battle, but that is what we have left.

Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/04/2021 06:42 PM
Yeah today was a bit of a yawner.

But it will be a long two weeks for UAE. Pog was alone with about 8 k to go. There will be nipping at the heels and some stages will lend themselves for surprises. As long as the teams with guys fighting for crumbs don’t cancel each other out that is.
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/05/2021 07:51 AM
Or Pog will fail a doping screen. Superhuman riding right now.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/06/2021 09:42 AM
Porte and Thomas crashed - again. I should have kept an Ineos scorecard. Haven't both been down a couple of times already? And more than one Ineos rider down at the same time. Maybe Braillesford should fine his riders if they appear near riders with Ineos jerseys.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/06/2021 10:45 AM
Another D-QS masterpiece. The whole stage. Perhaps as boring as a Sky train. The whole day for Cavendish, then he delivers. And once again, that late, hard pull from the closest rider D-QS has to a GC man. (In the rainbow stripes, no less.)

Last year today's winner was ferrying WBs. Now he has the WC as domestique. Quite a team.
huckleberry

Posts:699

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07/06/2021 11:55 AM
DQS - the best "team" out there.

Ineos, the furthest from a "team" in the peloton.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/06/2021 07:33 PM
Can is a whole other person now. His teams just kills themselves for hime and he repays them with his wins and shows how much they all love each other. Have never seen this before in cycling.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/06/2021 08:13 PM
Quite the story.

If he makes Paris in green he could not possibly ask for a better retirement point. He’ll be too pricey for Patrick after this.
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/06/2021 08:44 PM
If Cav ties or passes Eddy in stage wins, it would be really cool for Eddy to congratulate him in person, and in public - a photo op for the ages.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/07/2021 08:49 AM
Ineos, the furthest from a "team" in the peloton


No, that honor goes to Movistar!

If Cav can make all the time cuts (still a big if), he’ll certainly break the record this year. And he better hope he does because I don’t know if he can do it with another team next year, and as noted, it may be tough for Lefevre to afford him next year.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/07/2021 12:12 PM
Cav and teammates pull it off. Seven minutes to spare. Not even close! (I'd like to know what software they have to manage the gap. More specifically, the math.)

Pogacar and Ineos? Is Ineos trying to adapt Pogacar? Does UAE have Ineos on retainer? Ineos spent the whole day managing the race for Pogacar. He could hardly have asked for better. And when he really needed help high on Ventoux, he had Carapaz for assistance. 6000' above sea level and after 8-10,000' of climbing, could you ask for better?


No glory for D-QS today. Alaphillippe didn't have it (any surprise after the quality work he has done for Cav?). He did get the jersey on camera for a while. The team horsepower was back in the gruppetto assisting Cav. Job well done. They live to showcase the jersey some more.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/07/2021 10:42 PM
To me another great stage. A rider that came less than foot from beating one of the all time greats in a sprint to winning one of the toughest stages in Tour history. Someone finally showed a tiny crack in the armor of T.P. Again a team showed how much love they have for one another. Not because It's always just about winning.
zootracer

Posts:788

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07/08/2021 11:43 PM
Sagan pulled out prior to start of stage 12. Knee injury. Too bad...
longslowdistance

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07/09/2021 06:22 AM
That injury was from Ewan taking him out earlier.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/09/2021 10:38 AM
I read in the CyclingNews race commentary that Tim Declercq of D-QS has never won a race (at 34 yo). Got thinking the man should be given MVP status for just how much he does to create team wins. There's a break up the road with real horsepower. You (as DS) know you have to control the race for that 40 km of open country and that you can easily waste your whole train doing it. But you have Declercq. Put him there and save everybody else! 40 km later, the break hasn't gained one second. Declercq peels off, spent. Sprint teams come to the fore, the break gets reeled in. Last 10 km, the famous D-QS train goes to work and delivers the appointed sprinter to the perfect take-off (with that train at full power because of that guy, Declercq, who will show up 15 minutes later with the gruppetto).

I hope he doesn't have more than bruises and road rash from today's spill. That maybe he can even enjoy not being part of the work! (He gets his little break - and yet another pay bonus as Cav matches the great EM. What a team! Morkov even hanging on to finish second and deny points to the green jersey rivals; all of whom save Philipsen were not even in the top 10.) I see that Merckx doesn't feel threatened! Glad for Cavendish who has come back from so much. Points out that his wins were in sprints, long breaks, in the mountains, in TTs, he has 5 yellow jerseys and he spent 96 days - or 4 1/2 entire Tours - wearing them. Modest Eddy.

Edit: back to the D-QS team.  Is there a better team at adjusting to road situations and stepping up as needed?  Today, down one diesel.  Still, the train runs on schedule, drops off Cav a little early who simply steps up, adjusts, goes long and still pulls it off.  On a day when the entire cycling world knew he was a marked man.  And on a Tour full of crashes, they have kept their sponsor showcases safe.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/09/2021 11:43 AM
I thought DQS had blown it on that lefthand sweeper in the final KM when they got swamped by DSM and Bahrain....Cav was pretty far back at that point (15-20th spot, it looked like).

But DQS got it back together and Cav worked his way back up. Very impressive.

As for the record, yes, technically he has tied it, but I don't really think there is any comparison between the two. Eddy's TdF career was shorter and had a vast variety of stage wins. The sport has changed drastically since his days and a sprinter racking up the same number of stages as him isn't really the same thing.

Not taking anything away form Cav...to equal the record (especially after his last few years) is impressive as hell. But it is just a different yardstick, IMO.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/09/2021 09:42 PM
Yes Cav is "merely" rounding out a great career and Merckx is still the Babe Ruth, Gretzky and Pele of cycling, and likely will be for a long time to come, Cav is goat with a small g and Eddy is GOAT in all caps. No one is claiming otherwise. Counterpoint: But still there IS a legit comparison: We are saying Cav and Merckx in the same sentence, and often in a good way for Cav. How many other riders have that honor? I can name a handful, but for most it was a briefer flame, like Thevenet and Guimard.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/10/2021 10:20 AM
Bauke!
huckleberry

Posts:699

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07/10/2021 10:24 AM
Great 40K time trial!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/10/2021 10:38 AM
In the Dutch speaking world the verb Mollemalen has been in existence. It means turning pedals in the manner of Mollema (ie rocking shoulders tongue sticking out).
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/11/2021 10:55 AM
Sepp Kuss pulls off a stage win! Got the go-ahead to dance at altitude where he thrives. I was afraid Valverde would be able to pull back 25 seconds on the downhill but glad to see Sepp pull it off. Today was a taste of what he did in Utah a few summers ago but this time against the big boys. (Yeah, Pogacar and such weren't there so it was Valverde and the break but still, some real climbing power.)
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/11/2021 11:03 AM
Its a home win for Kuss, he knew the climb and descent, said he didn't train it too often because its too hard (haha). His girlfriend was cheering for him at summit. Well played by JV with Wout pacing him to base of climb and then helping Jonas the fish guy on descent (as well as winning an earlier KOM).
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/13/2021 08:26 AM
Well deserved win by Sepp Kuss yesterday. Jumbo is salvaging this Tour.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/13/2021 10:57 AM
Matthews and Colbrelli are still lurking for green. Cavendish has his work cut out for him to bring it home but two more opportunities to score major points so as long as he survives the next two days he should be good. Either of those teams may send out guys on long-range escapes next two days to make for sharp cut-off times for Cav's grupetto.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/13/2021 01:50 PM
Posted By Orange Crush on 07/13/2021 10:57 AM
Matthews and Colbrelli are still lurking for green. Cavendish has his work cut out for him to bring it home but two more opportunities to score major points so as long as he survives the next two days he should be good. Either of those teams may send out guys on long-range escapes next two days to make for sharp cut-off times for Cav's grupetto.

This take me back 44 years to my heyday (for that that's worth!) of my racing; summer of '77.  Many weeks I would ride to Mt Wachusett for my mid-week long ride.  Often my training partner would join me.  (I passed her house 20 miles out.)  We'd ride a moderate pace to the base, then I would do the 1000' hard.  She'd take her time, we'd eat lunch then return via two tough climbs.

What brought this thought on was Cav being helped over the Pyrenees by his comrades.  Of course there is only so much they can do when the road gets steep (legally).  But the ultimate gift to a non-climber or spent rider?  The sustained push.

One week back then, I had use my day off to rebuild a wheel that had been trashed by a car the day before.  That meant riding early and being at work by 2pm.  (Bike shop Friday - all hands on deck.)  So we left early.  Usually Kate would simply ride toward my home easy, then turn around and join me.  Not that day.  I arrived at her house and gently knocked on her bedroom window.  A sleepy Kate appeared.  She was game so a quick breakfast and we were off.  She'd ridden the club race the night before, hence the sleep-in.  Lunch at 10am at the mountaintop.  Headed home.  Got to the first of the two tough hills and it was very obvious she didn't have the legs.  OK, I need to be back.  I can leave her and do it.  But it's 40 miles on tired legs for her, starting with these climbs.  I wouldn't exactly be a gentleman!

So I rode-up beside her from behind, put my hand on her butt and pushed.  (Not pre-planned.  Seatpost or brake cable never occurred to me.)  So, my left hand at the stem, me pushed back on the seat and powering the pedals for all l was worth.  OMG hard!  Next hill, same thing.  Up there with the hardest climbs I have ever done.  The gift that I wasn't going to appreciate until years later when I tried to push someone else was that Kate was a very skilled rider.  Rode rock solid while I pushed.  I didn't need to steer, just follow her and power like a tandem stoker.

So, back to Cav.  Yes, that push would be highly illegal and very visible if there is anybody around.  At the same time, if Morkov or Declercq were to do such an illegal act - wow would that be an effort/sacrifice for a teammate!
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/13/2021 08:08 PM
"So I rode-up beside her from behind, put my hand on her butt and pushed"

Opps, Im sorry, my mind went on a different tract there.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/13/2021 08:25 PM
Posted By Bill H. on 07/13/2021 08:08 PM
"So I rode-up beside her from behind, put my hand on her butt and pushed"

Opps, Im sorry, my mind went on a different tract there.


Summer of 77 LOL. No can do this anymore. FWIW back in the 80s I used same technique to push heavier male team members over hills. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/13/2021 10:38 PM
I just remembered the reason that push was so bloody hard. In those days, I didn't ride low gears. 95% of my racing and training was on a 13-19 FW. Sugino Mighty crankset. I'd stand and loaf for an easy pace with my partner.

mondonico, thoughts of the appropirateness didn't cross my mind until after the deed was done and we were locked into the ship and assisting tug mode. Then it was "well there's nobody here but us and she's not complaining". And "we're getting over the hill".
Dale

Posts:1494

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07/14/2021 08:17 AM
I did that once in a race with a combined men/ woman field. One of the women kept sliding off the back so I went back, asked permission to help and explained that I'd put my hand on the small of her back. After rescuing her twice I brought her to the middle of the field and told her "good luck" and worked my way up near the front.

The crap my buddies dished out to me was fantastic!
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/14/2021 10:39 AM
Welp....that was anticlimactic.

Pog did only what ne needed to do......the three strongest guys in the race finally separated themselves and we have the clear podium now.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/14/2021 01:10 PM
Rigo can still rock back onto podium via iTT, but it depends on tomorrow.

I thought the racing on final climb was good today. Pog looked pretty tired at finish but, like VDP, he recovers within minutes and is all smiles again. JV have another gem in Vingegaard (they also have Foss).
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/14/2021 01:49 PM
BTW - JV had great use of the ears today. van Aert spent the entire final climb shouting encouragement to Jonas via radio. They may be down to four but spirits are high.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/15/2021 05:20 AM
Police raid Bahrain-Victorious hotel…..

https://cyclingtips.com/2021/07/police-search-bahrain-victorious-tour-de-france-team-hotel/
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Dale

Posts:1494

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07/15/2021 05:04 PM
Once they hit the climb it was a forgone conclusion.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/15/2021 05:42 PM
Now the top 3 is set. Uran may be feeling effects of imperfect preparation and covid.

JV should have sent Kuss up the road instead of pacing towards the foregone conclusion. Then again, Vingegaard was not on a good day he said post-race so maybe they were playing it safe and steady.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/15/2021 05:43 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 07/15/2021 05:20 AM
Police raid Bahrain-Victorious hotel…..

https://cyclingtips.com/2021/07/police-search-bahrain-victorious-tour-de-france-team-hotel/


They did something similar with Quintana, was it last year? And found nothing in the end, so this doesn't necessarily mean anything. Time will tell.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/15/2021 05:44 PM
Posted By Cosmic Kid on 06/22/2021 09:57 AM
My podium:

Pog
Carapaz
Maybe Lopez?

Green:
Sagan

Mountains:
Who knows...some GC favorite who needs to redeem himself.

Rog crashes out in the first week. Thomas flops in the mountains. MvP takes an early yellow jersey (not much of a prediction...first two days are perfect for him and he wants yellow to honor Poulidor).


Pretty close, with obvious miss of the fish guy as surprise this year. And Cavendish coming out of retirement of course. Lopez, when he won the Ventoux event earlier, I observed that riding fast uphill is one thing, but you have to still be fresh by the time you reach the mountains.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/15/2021 09:51 PM
IN another prediction thread on the trainer Road forum, I had the 3rd podium slot going to an unknown....so I kinda had it covered.

(or maybe it was in a text to a buddy.....I forget)

But definitely one of my better year for predictions!! Extra credit for the Rog prediction.....for a guy that used to be a ski jumper, his bike handling is awful. (But I guess his ski jumping control wasn't much better )
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
6ix

Posts:415

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07/15/2021 10:55 PM
Question. Knowing what we do now about so many riders in the past (ahem, LA, Contador, Riis, Ullrich, Pantani, Froome, etc.), how can you enjoy watching the complete BS we've witnessed over the past few days in the Tour? This kind of domination is what LA used to do and we all know how that ended.

I don't know...I was just left shaking my head today when Pog basically coasted through the final turn before the finish and didn't even look that awful tired.

I always go back to my argument that these are the best 200 cyclists in the world. Out of nearly 8 billion people on this planet, here are the top 200. They are all freaks of nature yet this 22 year old blows the best of the best of the best out of the water. Come on! We've all seen this before.

Am I just too cynical now? Obviously, nearly all of them are using products that bend the rules or are just good at covering their tracks. But good grief people, at least keep it looking realistic enough to be somewhat believable.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/15/2021 11:25 PM
"But definitely one of my better year for predictions!! Extra credit for the Rog prediction.....for a guy that used to be a ski jumper, his bike handling is awful. (But I guess his ski jumping control wasn't much better )"

Guess that's why he left the sport. Lot higher to fall from.

As for doping I have no Idea. If one is. the majority of the contenders must be, just as in the past. So again the past theory was LA had the best so maybe TP has now. And I listened to someone say the only way they can beat Pogaca is in the first week before everyone is on the same level.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/16/2021 12:31 AM
In the LA years we had an entire team on the sauce and towing the peloton for a lap around France.

Don’t know if kid is clean or not but as a team I doubt UAE we’re on the sauce. Pog was often fending for himself.

That is a massive difference with those days. Realistically Pog lost his main competitor Roglic. No 2 on podium is a newbie who lost time waiting for Roglic. Carapaz alone is no match and Ineos multi head dragon also became a snail with crashes in week one. I’d like to see Pog go up to a full strength field and in heat we never had.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/16/2021 01:53 AM
We also had the case of Uran. He rides for a believable team. He was sitting pretty in second until last two days not that far off. We know why he fell back. Had Covid, which made his preparations so so. In the end you pay the price.

Kelderman in 5th. The guys got talent but how many times can you crash yourself in three weeks. Flat on his face yesterday for no apparent reason.

I don’t think we witnessed anything super abnormal this year. Maybe I’m wrong but I was entertained.
Dale

Posts:1494

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07/16/2021 02:57 AM
Time to revisit the jersey topic. When you lead the GC, Climbers, and Young Rider category you need a jersey that reflects all three (or whatever number someone leads) like it was back in the day. Give a modified white or polkadot jersey to whoever is in 2nd place if you wish but quit the nonsense that someone is leading the points when it's really the guy in yellow.

White jersey with a black band around the chest or something to designate 2nd place in the competition.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/16/2021 10:31 AM
Interesting developments and somewhat weird coincidences with the host cities. Drugs, Pau. We've seen this before. Cav with a shot at surpassing Merckx. Start kicked of from Mourenx, cite of Merckx's incredible solo, kicking off on Tourmlalet, soloing over the next pass and finishing 8 minutes up after 140 km t double his lead. "Cannibal" was coined here. 1969 when I believe he was a Tour rookie.

And random comments. All the talk of Pogacar's performance and the certainty by many of drugs ... pales in comparison to that young Merckx and this year's field is so decimated that there is nobody in Pogacar's league left with anything of a team. (Also more than a few riders clearly haven't done their (training) homework and Pogacar obviously did.) I'm not saying I "know" Pogacar is clean but I haven't seen damning evidence.

The photo of Cav and Merckx with their arms over their shoulders ... all the talk's been about Merckx's terse summary of his accomplishments. I'm betting that quote came after the journalist prodded him to react to Cav's tying his TdF stage record. (Have we ever seen Merxkx to be short with the media? ) But face to face with a world class rider ... issues like that just don't matter.

And last - Pogacar nearly got DSQ'd today. 5 minutes from not making the time cut. (Along with about 120 other riders including all the contenders for all the jerseys).
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/16/2021 02:02 PM
Posted By Orange Crush on 07/16/2021 01:53 AM


Kelderman in 5th. The guys got talent but how many times can you crash yourself in three weeks. Flat on his face yesterday for no apparent reason.


JFC, he crashed again today. What the hell.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/16/2021 03:12 PM
Interesting, the current top 14 is riders from 14 different teams if I am looking correct.
huckleberry

Posts:699

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07/16/2021 04:34 PM
I'm with 6ix. I feel that Pog let up on stages that he could have won merely for public strategy to make it appear he is mortal. He never had any issue dragging himself back up to the leaders, despite what the commentators were trying to say that he was put in difficulty. It feels like the LA years all over again. Spread the love around the peloton to different riders, to different teams to keep everybody happy...

Call me cynic, but LA made me that way ; )
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/16/2021 08:12 PM
Slovenia suddenly produces dominant racers. Sure, why not.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/16/2021 08:32 PM
OK all you racers help me understand a few things. One. Mahoric breaks away with what 15 miles to go. The other nine piss on each other. Attacking each other and as soon as they get a small separation turn around and look back. Three get a gap and don't work together. So you drag someone and they win the stage yo'ur still first loser. And lastly why the going from one side of the road to the other. I ran track many many years ago and was told by my coach I needed to work on not running like a duck. Every 1/4 mile I was losing a few inches. If your in the last mile or so and fight for the stage as a group I get it. Not ten miles from the finish. Just the most annoying stage I have seen in some time. Good for Mahoric.
Dale

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07/16/2021 08:54 PM
Zig-zagging to shake the guy off your wheel.
Guaranteed to work 0% of the time but they (we) keep trying.

IIRR that's one definition of insanity.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/16/2021 09:44 PM
See that's what I don't understand about doing it ten miles out when chasing a single rider. I would think you want riders on your wheel to work together to reel the rider in. First loser is first loser no matter how it works out. Take a chance to do something career changing.
79pmooney

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07/16/2021 10:11 PM
The flip side of this. Riding like this happens. Smart riders sometimes gamble on it happening. Sometimes that gamble pays off.

Edit: there was an infamous stage a few years back where a rider who'd tanked the day before gambled that he could gain enough time in the first two hills and that the three podium sitting teams would infight and not successfully use the 20 miles of flat to chase him down.  I was watching that stage and said to my table mate that the DS's of the podium sitters needed to each radio their leader and instruct the team to work the other two in a massive TTT.  I said this while those opening climbs were happening.

But no.  On the flat, one or two strong worker for one team would power for long pulls, take two minutes out of the lead, pull off and everyone would sit up and take a breath.  Meanwhile the solo leader was just riding to his power meter (or maybe it was heart rate), keep the needle on high and take back the lost time over and over again.  Went into the final big climb with the margin he needed.  Won him a Tour.  (Well, until a positive for testosterone came back.)

I'm not a fan of doping at all.  But on that stage, the three podium sitting teams didn't deserve the placed they achieved in Paris.  Floyd Landis correctly gambled that they would not get their **** together.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/17/2021 07:44 AM
Slovenia suddenly produces dominant racers. Sure, why not


This is why I have questions….we have seen in the past that when one country rises to the top of the sport, there are questionable methods behind it. Italy in the 90’s, the US in the 00’s, GB in the teens….now in the 20’s, Slovenia (a country with zero cycling background) has produced the best 2 riders in the world (and whose national champ has won 2 stages so far).

Throw in UAE’s questionable management, Pog’s dominant performance, etc and it is reasonable to be suspicious.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/17/2021 07:50 AM
First loser is first loser no matter how it works out.


Right….so they are gambling on someone else to be the sucker and do the work. If they do the work, they lose. If no one does the work, they lose. So hope someone else is willing to do it.

Couple years ago I did a training crit….got in a 3 man break and we were gone. I knew both of those guys would wax me in the sprint, so I had 3rd no matter what. So I gambled…on the last lap, I let a gap open to one of the guys and sat up. Other guy ( who had one the week before) kept wanting me to pull…”Look, if I do that, I get third. You’ll both beat me in the sprint. If you want the win, you better chase. I’m third either way”. So he chased, we caught the other guy and I ended up 2nd because I rolled the dice on someone else doing the work.

Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/17/2021 10:17 AM
Luxembourg population 650000 managed to produce a whole bunch of top end racers all that one in days of Schlecks. To the degree the dimwit idea of of a Lux team got started. Slovenia does have a strong cycling background although not a history of pro cycling. Slovenia sits next to Italy that region is fairly cycling mad and their capital was an early adopter of Scandinavia/ Dutch style cycling infrastructure which is rare in that neck of the woods. It’s a prime cycling destination.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/17/2021 01:18 PM
My suspicions on Slovenia revolve around Aderlass connections and questionable managers (noting that Roglic left that circle pretty quick but others are still within it) but the notions of it being a small country with no cycling history don't have any traction (hog wash). Time will tell.

Four Danes in the iTT top 10 today is possibly also some food for thought.

Today was warmer and Pog underperformed similar to how he underperformed in their nationals iTT rocking on that bike and constantly looking up and down, never comfortable.

The WTF moment of the day was Bilbao with full radio equipment in hand trying to put it back on his back while negotiating a corner.
huckleberry

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07/17/2021 01:47 PM
I remember when Lance had everyone making excuses for him also ; )

But, but...
Cosmic Kid

Posts:3642

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07/17/2021 02:17 PM
It is not just that Slovenia is a small country w/ little background in professional cycling….that is just one element. But when such a country is suddenly at the top of the sport, combined with questionable management, refusal to hold open press conferences, having riders posting times that beat doped riders up climbs, etc

It is a holistic view of all these things that makes me go “Hmmmm…I think I have seen this movie before”

And yes, Aderlass is absolutely part of that puzzle. I had forgotten to mention that earlier.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/17/2021 02:33 PM
Posted By christopher behrens on 07/17/2021 01:47 PM
I remember when Lance had everyone making excuses for him also ; )

But, but...


They’re not excuses. I simply tend to stick to the facts. The facts are the Aderlass connection and questionable managers. A possible line of evidence is dominance. The rest is hearsay and conspiracy theories. The cycling audience is good at those, maybe for good reason. The cycling background question could be flipped around, why did a country with a pretty strong cycling culture not produce any top end racers in the past? Why has a country like Belgium with a massive pro racing pedigree not produced a Tour de France competitor for decades? Typically these questions are answered by lack of opportunity or examples for kids being drawn to the sport.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/17/2021 03:52 PM
BTW last time we had a time gap this big was 2024, Nibali, he had over 7 minutes on number 2 by the time they got to Paris.

It was when top contenders crashed out. Sounds familiar.
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/17/2021 05:34 PM
Posted By Orange Crush on 07/17/2021 03:52 PM
BTW last time we had a time gap this big was 2024, Nibali, he had over 7 minutes on number 2 by the time they got to Paris.

It was when top contenders crashed out. Sounds familiar.
I slept well last night but I thought I set the alarm for six hours, not six years!

mondonico

Posts:137

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07/17/2021 08:12 PM
So my belief is next year they bring back the TTT to try and even out the tour.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/17/2021 08:16 PM
Went right over my head first time I read your post. Good catch. Mooney
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/18/2021 12:23 PM
Haha yes 2014 Ben.

Van Aert mountain goat, time trialist, sprinter. A decimated JV had a better Tour than last year.
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/18/2021 01:32 PM
And they had just four riders for what the last week? Still a better year.
longslowdistance

Posts:2468

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07/18/2021 05:52 PM
Great sprint. QS was gassed. Cav got boxed in. Very impressive win.
zootracer

Posts:788

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07/19/2021 07:33 PM
cyclingtips.com/2021/07/a-photographers-love-letter-to-the-2021-tour-de-france/

Some real nice pics here. Hope this link works.

Zoot
mondonico

Posts:137

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07/19/2021 07:46 PM
Great photos thanks.

Only caption I would change. A Big damn wall to a damn big wall.
Nick A

Posts:623

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07/21/2021 09:49 AM
Well, I actully enjoyed The Tour... but I only watched about an hour total, covering about six stages, all after the fact, on YouTube. LOL.

Nick
79pmooney

Posts:2779

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07/21/2021 10:40 AM
I enjoyed it a lot. My disappointment was that so many teams showed up unprepared or rode without focus. (The crashes. Sky - "we'll throw half the team against the wall and see who sticks".) Two teams rode great Tours and deserved every bit of what they got. UAE and D-QS. Their leaders lead with class. (Yes, Pogacar has been second guessed many times for his answers on doping suspicions. So what? He's young and not a diplomat. Whatever he says is going to be wrong in some eyes. His words here really don't matter; just what he has done and what becomes known. Plus journalists are known for prodding for press worthy comments. Think Eddy Merckx's answer re: Cav tying his TdF stage win record, then the photo days later of Merckx and Cav, two great cyclists, hugging.)

I loved seeing so many breaks succeed. Watching the GC standings getting rocked by breaks. The stories within the story. Van Aert winning three so different stages (and doing real work for his teammates). D-QS escorting Cav to timely finishes. A Tour that has been very close to scandal free. (Drugs will always be on the discussion table. That Pogacar so dominated has raised eyebrows. But no other rider/team rode a crash/serious mechanical/missed split free Tour. That's 5 minutes right there.)

The final time trial was boring for me. But I even liked that. I enjoy seeing the race played out on the road, mass start. I thought it kinda cool that the top 18 places held after the TT. Don't think I've ever seen that before.
Orange Crush

Posts:3660

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07/21/2021 10:56 AM
Yes, Pog's personal dominance aside I really enjoyed this tour as there wasn't really any single dominant team. Lots of successful breaks, interesting stages etc. On final mountain climbs domestiques setting a hard pace really didn't factor as much as it did other years, it was really the leaders battling each other (like in a typical Giro or Vuelta).

Better than last year where despite Pog's last minute surprise the rest of tour was basically JV taking the peloton for a cruise across France.


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