So what's next? (spoiler)
Last Post 07/08/2013 10:13 AM by j t. 37 Replies.
Author Messages
longslowdistance

Posts:743

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07/06/2013 02:00 PM
Utter domination by Sky in the mountains, in this Tour that is heavy on mountain stages. The pasting resembled Indurain's first Tour win, where with the help of EPO he utterly steamrolled everyone in the first TT, but add to that a teammate (Porte) who's almost as good.
AC looks uncomfortable on a climb, perhaps a Clenbuterol deficit?
Valverde was there, good ride, but a notch below Porte.
BMG out of it, sorry to say. At least Cadel tried. TJ lived to fight another day, hopefully he won't get accustomed to cyclotouring.
Maybe the young Columbian Quintana will do a better job eating on the descent before the final climb next time and give the Skyborgs a run. I hope so because otherwise this race is over.
CERV

Posts:151

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07/06/2013 02:14 PM
Coincidently, the UK owned cyclingnews (Future PLC) forum went down today during the stage. Guess they didn't want the chatter in the clinic?
CERV

Posts:151

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07/06/2013 02:19 PM
____AX-3-DOMAINES (BONASCRE), ALL-TIME TOP 100 LIST part I

____8.90 km, 7.46 &, 664 m

_1. Roberto Laiseka _____ ESP | 22:57 | 2001
_2. Lance Armstrong _____ USA | 22:59 | 2001
_3. Chris Froome ________ GBR | 23:14 | 2013
_4. Jan Ullrich _________ GER | 23:17 | 2003
_5. Haimar Zubeldia _____ ESP | 23:19 | 2003
_6. Jan Ullrich _________ GER | 23:22 | 2001
_7. Lance Armstrong _____ USA | 23:24 | 2003
_8. Alexandre Vinokourov_ KAZ | 23:34 | 2003
_9. Ivan Basso __________ ITA | 23:36 | 2003
10. Lance Armstrong _____ USA | 23:40 | 2005

10. Ivan Basso __________ ITA | 23:42 | 2005
11. Oscar Sevilla _______ ESP | 23:45 | 2001
12. Joseba Beloki _______ ESP | 23:45 | 2001
13. Denis Menchov _______ RUS | 23:47 | 2010
14. Samuel Sanchez ______ ESP | 23:47 | 2010
15. Jan Ullrich _________ GER | 24:00 | 2005
16. Andy Schleck ________ LUX | 24:01 | 2010
17. Joaquim Rodriguez ___ ESP | 24:01 | 2010
18. Robert Gesink _______ NED | 24:01 | 2010
19. Alberto Contador ____ ESP | 24:01 | 2010
20. Jurgen van den Broeck BEL | 24:01 | 2010

21. Richie Porte ________ AUS | 24:05 | 2013
22. Levi Leipheimer _____ USA | 24:15 | 2005
23. Floyd Landis ________ USA | 24:15 | 2005
24. Iban Mayo ___________ ESP | 24:15 | 2003
25. Santiago Botero _____ COL | 24:19 | 2001
26. Michael Boogerd _____ NED | 24:19 | 2001
27. Alexandre Vinokourov_ KAZ | 24:19 | 2001
28. Stefano Garzelli ____ ITA | 24:19 | 2001
29. Inigo Chaureau ______ ESP | 24:19 | 2001
30. Marcos Serrano ______ ESP | 24:19 | 2001
jrt1045

Posts:362

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07/06/2013 02:45 PM
Today was terrible for the sport, a true spectacle of the next generation of doping. As we've learned in the past year, if it's too good to be true.... Those 2 are donkeys to racehorses, I will refuse to believe the transformation

You are a brave man, don't think I can stomach even to click on cyclingnews as the English and Aussies on there will be insufferable

at least they have 8 years to figure what Porte and Froome are taking.
Inferno7

Posts:280

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07/06/2013 02:55 PM
Sorry Froome is a doper no flippin way he's clean. And he's a dumb ass for ruining the tour by pedaling his doped to the gills ass over the line 10 minutes ahead of the competition. Thanks tour is over at the end of week one.

As far as Tejay is concerned I'm not sure what he did before the climbs but he looked like dog $4it and was no help to Cadel at all. HA.....this dude thinks he's a contender. BMC is a joke.
JS

Posts:61

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07/06/2013 03:57 PM
Stage 8. Ax-3-Domaines (first 7.85 km, 8.30 %, 651 m). Chris Froome: 21 min 41 sec, 21.72 Kph, VAM; 1801 m/h, 6.37 W/kg
Orange Crush

Posts:1251

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07/06/2013 09:29 PM
Was Froome aware he was flying by a radar post http://www.alternativeditions.com/la-preuve-par-21/les-radars-du-tour-2013/
Hoshie

Posts:123

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07/07/2013 12:09 AM
Final blow for the sport if he gets popped for doping.


J
Keith Richards

Posts:759

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07/07/2013 12:30 AM
Eddy Merckx won Le Tour by almost 20 min and took all three jerseys and you all laud him as the greatest cyclist of all time. Froome lays down the law on the first day in the mountains after a week of doing nothing but using Le Tour to build his form and you guys lose your minds.
----- It is his word versus ours. We like our word. We like where we stand and we like our credibility."--Lance Armstrong.
Hoshie

Posts:123

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07/07/2013 12:32 AM
Different time, different methods. Those days are long gone in cycling KR given modern training and equipment and the general level of play

J
Keith Richards

Posts:759

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07/07/2013 12:36 AM
It was not even a long day in the mountains. An easy spin for most of the day. Look at the profile.
----- It is his word versus ours. We like our word. We like where we stand and we like our credibility."--Lance Armstrong.
CERV

Posts:151

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07/07/2013 01:52 AM
i don't know about 'losing our minds'

I'm mostly disappointed that the anti-doping culture has castrated some, while some are still obviously doing whatever they want. Contador and Schleck are both capable of riding at the levels we saw from Froome today, but Contador is no longer in a position where he can risk it. Wouldn't it be great to have seen 2011 giro Contador responding to that attack today?
I just want to see an actual close race and be entertained. Merckxx was before my time, but I'm sure those races he won by 20 min would be as boring as hell to watch. The difference was that this year has the potential to be a nail biter with the riders that are in the GC, but all the players aren't allowed to play by the same rules.

The best part is that until Froome got to the flat section at the top (with a headwind), he had the fastest time in history going. Faster than Armstrong 2001.
thinline

Posts:153

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07/07/2013 06:55 AM
Interesting debate. I figured it was game over after yesterday, but tuned in this a.m. and maybe not. I won't type more in case people who are okay with reading yesterday's spoiler click on this before watching today. I will admit that yesterday Sky looked like Sky from last year but on steroids. Just a saying, there!
Dale

Posts:524

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07/07/2013 07:41 AM
Not loosing our minds, it's just that we've heard so much quacking the last 20 years that turned out to be ducks that when we hear quacking again we, right or wrong, suspect another duck is sitting on the front porch and we don't want it crapping all over our yard.

If it turns out to be a myna bird rather than a duck we'll apologize to both
stronz

Posts:315

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07/07/2013 08:59 AM
I am sorry, but fool me once...wait make that fool me one dozen times shame on you. The second dozen times I start to catch on. I find the performance very suspect. thing is he's been doing it all year. find it hard to believe he's been dirty all year. but is he better than armstrong at the height of his doping career? and that VAM? thems doping #'s.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:1192

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07/07/2013 09:11 AM
Ok, to perhaps give a better example of what Keith was alluding to, what about Sagan? Talk about some quacking....guy is capable of going head-to-head with arguably the fastest sprinter ever, but can also clear Cat 2 climbs and win on multiple terrains. But everyone talks about how "talented" he is, but Froome gets ripped for one day in the mountains, which is his specialty.

Froome looked like he was suffering, which was something you never saw w/ Lance, AC and other rides in the 00's. I even thought at one point that he may have gone too early.

D I think Froome is clean? Hell, I dunno. But if we are judging doping on the basis of performances alone, I'm gonna look at Sagan long before Froome.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Keith Richards

Posts:759

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07/07/2013 09:33 AM
He avg 6.5 for only 22 min. If he did that for the Le alpe d'huez, again...then I'd call bull$4it.
----- It is his word versus ours. We like our word. We like where we stand and we like our credibility."--Lance Armstrong.
Dale

Posts:524

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07/07/2013 10:18 AM
Sorry for cast aspersions on the mynah bird... you sure did a great duck imitation yesterday

Break out the hourglass, the gaps are going to be huge
jmdirt

Posts:752

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07/07/2013 10:31 AM
KR, You must have missed my post about EM. I'm not shocked by any rider winning a climb by two minutes, its his time up the final climb that makes me wonder. I know a lot of factors come into play but... EDIT: I agree with the ?? about PS. I brought that up in one of his butt pinching threads and most didn't like it.
Keith Richards

Posts:759

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07/07/2013 10:36 AM
It was only a 22 min effort. After a flat run in. After a week where he did no work. Totally believable on the first day in the mountains for a climbing specialist.
----- It is his word versus ours. We like our word. We like where we stand and we like our credibility."--Lance Armstrong.
jmdirt

Posts:752

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07/07/2013 10:40 AM
Noting in any pro sport is "totally believable". ;}
bobswire

Posts:303

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07/07/2013 11:03 AM
That's entertainment,it is what it is, nothing more.
BikeCzar

Posts:53

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07/07/2013 11:30 AM
Everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt. Large gaps are exactly what I would expect from a cleaner peloton. I find the blatant accusations offensive. Cycling fans will be the death of their own sport. Get a grip.
Orange Crush

Posts:1251

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07/07/2013 11:33 AM
When did Froome become a climbing specialist - when he joined Sky?

Sagan's been killing it since he was a kid.

No evidence, it just all seems too programmable with Sky looking not just at yesterday's stage but the big picture of last couple years.
CERV

Posts:151

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07/07/2013 11:38 AM
It also wasn't a flat run in. It was preceded by an HC climb.
Gonzo Cyclist

Posts:238

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07/07/2013 12:07 PM
After today, things look a bit different, Porte is out of contention, Froome was isolated most of the day, Valverde is bringing it (but, I think the boy is up to something, again)
Contador has Krueziger there, but he lost Noval today, still some good stuff to come, I hope the Spaniards all get together, bust up the Sky Train
79pmooney

Posts:1192

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07/07/2013 12:10 PM
I did not like what I saw yesterday, but I have to give Froome some credit. He is in the form of his life. Not a surprise at all after last year. (If I hadn't seen the head injury after my year of racing very hard, I could have dominated some races the next year and ridden at a level where anyone watching me grow up would have said "What! Where did that come from?")  Sky did their homework. Yesterday's course was a good one to set a record time up that final climb. Short, flat till the first climb. Sky controlled the pace, but it really wasn't that hard. They gave away a minute to Quintana who rode a good climb, but Quintana is still a young rider. In a year or two, if Quintana keeps building his form, Sky might have to work a lot harder to keep him within a minute. And if Qintana could descend a little faster and remember to eat (He will learn both of those) that minute could be very dangerous.

But as it was, that first climb was not that hard for a very disciplined Sky team. On the last climb, Porte gave it his all. He was toast today. Froome, who did little lead work yesterday, then put in a very hard 20 minute effort. It worked rather well. Put nearly two minutes on Contador who said he was only 90% (and that was observed by all coming into the Tour).

If Porte flew today, my first thought would be "that Sky training". Porte flew like a lead balloon. Liike you would expect any human to do after what he did yesterday. I don't think anyone would argue that Froome is not naturally a step above Porte. So Froome being comfortable today when he was not pushed and did far less work than Porte is not such a huge surprise.

Now, if Froome is still on this platoo (sp) 10 days from now after he has been pushed hard, I'll have my doubts. At this point it looks like he prepared better than anyone else for the Tour. Now, if Contador (and perhaps Valverde and Rodriguez) come around and Froome does start seeing all the hard riding he has done this year catch up, we may see a very different final week.

I want this Tour to be clean. I also want to see Contador win. I like his attitude, his racing style and his racing smarts. But he may not have done enough work to pull this Tour off. (I read today that Contador has backed off on motorpacing since he got married because of it's perceived danger and that his training has taken a hit because of that. Sounds believable to me. Matches both what I am seeing and my thought that Contador is not stupid and might even have a life beyond the bike.)

Ben
Keith Richards

Posts:759

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07/07/2013 01:10 PM
Contador has not had a good year period. Froome was a beast in almost every race he entered this year.

What I was yesterday was consistent with what I have seen from GC favorites considering their results so far this season.

If Sky had 4 or 5 guys leading up all the climbs today ala postal/discovery in their prime, then I would be raising an eyebrow. But today we had Froome totally isolated and his right hand man spent.

I don't like Froome much at all. No style on the bike. But I am seeing nothing to make me think he is doped to the gills. He is young and in the form of his life.

Posted By Bike Czar on 07/07/2013 11:30 AM
Everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt. Large gaps are exactly what I would expect from a cleaner peloton. I find the blatant accusations offensive. Cycling fans will be the death of their own sport. Get a grip.


Preach brother!
----- It is his word versus ours. We like our word. We like where we stand and we like our credibility."--Lance Armstrong.
Keith Richards

Posts:759

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07/07/2013 01:37 PM
Posted By CERV __ on 07/07/2013 11:38 AM
It also wasn't a flat run in. It was preceded by an HC climb.


Compare yesterdays profile:



With todays:



The difference is HUGE. It made a massive difference in how fresh legs were when the serious climbing occurred.
----- It is his word versus ours. We like our word. We like where we stand and we like our credibility."--Lance Armstrong.
jmdirt

Posts:752

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07/07/2013 03:16 PM
WAAAAIT a minute Keith Romney! Are you doing a little shifting on us here? Were's that "Come on man" sign when we need it? The comparison was to other trips up that climb. What did the stage profile, distance, average speed, etc look like when the turbo blood guys flew up it? Not what did yesterdays profile look like compared to todays. "I don't like Froome much at all. No style on the bike. But I am seeing nothing to make me think he is doped to the gills. He is young and in the form of his life." At the speed of turbo blood guys though?
Berzin

Posts:34

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07/07/2013 04:26 PM
I think today's stage would have been much more interesting and dramatic had it ended at the top of the last climb at 138 kilometers. A short stage with 5 good climbs? Epic.

As it is, the Tour organizers again attempted to outsmart themselves and failed miserably.

There is nothing more anti-climactic than a mountain stage that ends in over 20 kilometers of downhill. All today's stage did was tire out some riders before a rest day.

To have nothing of consequence happen to the overall is a waste of a mountain stage.

As for Froome and his antics yesterday, it wasn't so much that he was so good (he was), it's that everyone else was so bad. Watch the stage again and tell me how the other contenders could lose so much time on the first day of mountains. If Froome only had one epic day in him, he picked the right one to win the Tour on. Sometimes it's not so much the course, but how the riders ride it.

Froome was isolated almost all day today, and no one moved to rip his legs apart. If those pathetic attempts to break him were all they had, then this Tour IS over.
Entheo

Posts:317

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07/07/2013 05:10 PM
well, speaking of today's stage (stage 9), sky went bye-bye, except for froome. after the quintana attacks on the final climb where was valverde's attack to reward all the work the team put in? not there. same with contador.

i again maintain that the results this season prove the peloton is much cleaner than years past. one rider (can't remember who) said whereas the peloton used to be 90% dirty it's now 90% clean. based on what i'm seeing this season that looks about right to me. question is, who's the 10%, dunno.

yes froome is strong but he's been strong. yesterday's stage results didn't look suspect to me; in fact i thought it was an epic stage with a columbian again showing his natural conditioning off the front. team sky burned a lot of matches and it showed up today. now froome can relax until the alps (TT the exception). will reassess the situation then.
CERV

Posts:151

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07/07/2013 06:37 PM
seeing porte pay today for his effort yesterday was definitely a sign of a human rider.
sucks for porte, but in a way it was also ncie to see.
Hoshie

Posts:123

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07/07/2013 10:19 PM
Kr - I do see your pt. we shall see how this little drama unfolds...
Cosmic Kid

Posts:1192

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07/07/2013 10:36 PM
Today's stage was a nice little throwback to the mountain stages of the 80's. Guys going for it from WAY out to isolate the race leader. A small group of favorites emerging to fight mano a mano for quite awhile.

May have been one of the best stages in le Tour in years.

And SKY is apparently human afterall.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Ride On

Posts:454

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07/08/2013 06:13 AM
Sorry I saw just the opposite yesterday

seeing porte pay today for his effort yesterday was definitely a sign of a human rider.
sucks for porte, but in a way it was also nice to see.

Richie got with in one min of getting back on after missing the train, riding solo!! If someone hadn't gotten in his ear piece and told him to shut it down and he finished with the lead group all kind of bells would have been going off. When he was chasing to get back on he was flying , making up ground and dropping everyone in sight. He wasn't paying for the day before effort. I think he lost a lot of time out of choice.
durielk

Posts:41

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07/08/2013 09:03 AM
When the camera showed Porte, not making contact with the lead group, he looked like he was out for a sunday ride. Froome looked like he was working, but Porte, no! Maybe he is special and has no sweat pores?
jrt1045

Posts:362

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07/08/2013 10:13 AM
I will invoke my right to cynicism for a period of no more and no less than 8 eight years


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