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Vaccines - the graphenes of the COVID world
Last Post 01/21/2022 10:40 PM by 79 pmooney. 184 Replies.
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Cosmic Kid

Posts:4209

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04/13/2021 02:52 PM
It's hard to do meaningful statistics with n=6


Which is why the issue never came up in any of the trials....it is such a minute risk that you likely would never see it come up until you literally had treated millions of people. The risk of COVID is FAR greater than the risk of clots....

I appreciate the abundance of caution form the FDA, but context is important. As it is, people were already saying they would wait for the other 2 vaccines vs. taking the J&J. This will only make that situation worse....the best vaccine you can get is the one you get in your arm ASAP.

If I was looking for a vaccine, I'd take the J&J w/o hesitation.....

Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:4499

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04/13/2021 03:13 PM
"All six cases were in women between the ages of 18 and 48."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-closely-monitoring-johnson-johnson-1.5985580

That makes it read similar to instances AZ in younger women. If one thinks about it mechanistically instead of statistically, one might actually wonder about similarity in causes of these cases since both vaccines were designed on a similar premise. As opposed to Pritzer and Moderna which are designed on a completely different premise.
Cosmic Kid

Posts:4209

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04/13/2021 03:40 PM
one might actually wonder about similarity in causes of these cases since both vaccines were designed on a similar premise.


That is definitely the prevalent thinking right now....
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
longslowdistance

Posts:2886

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04/13/2021 04:08 PM
What I wish poobahs would add is the prevalence of these potentially catastrophic thromboses in the unvaccinated population. As near as I can tell, the vaccines roughly double the risk, 1 in 1M rather 1 in 2M
Orange Crush

Posts:4499

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04/13/2021 09:19 PM
Fear is a funny thing. Unless the scientists can paint a clear picture of cause and effects there’s no amount of percentages we can throw at it that will take away the fear. People will simply look at the articles on clotting risk, read about reasons for it not being understood and go naaaah I’ll wait for another vaccine , as little sense as that decision and fear makes. A full 50% of Canadians is apprehensive about AZ vaccine and after today presumably also about Janssen. Those same people will step on a plane without blinking an eye even though we know that sitting still for longer flights also increases the risk of DVT. Risk perception is not created equal.
longslowdistance

Posts:2886

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04/13/2021 09:46 PM
True dat, just like the Euros, the pooch was screwed here in the litigious USA. Ironically - but correctly I still fully and confidently believe - I steered younger and middle aged female family and friends to J and J, because of the theoretical issues for them with the mRNA vaccines that do not have a long track record, plus of course the one and done convenience. As for the latest news, surely
they were far more likely to get hit by a car driving their shot than this serious but extremely rare potential complication.
79pmooney

Posts:3189

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04/13/2021 10:56 PM
The odds of me dying going to get my second shot Friday is probably higher than my odds dying (or even just suffering serious consequences) from any of these vaccines. Despite that, I'll go. (But will step aside to allow someone else, especially someone of color, their first shot. But I'm signed up to get that shot at a supermarket pharmacy in a wealthy neighborhood. So stepping aside probably means someone of means gets their second.)
Cosmic Kid

Posts:4209

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04/14/2021 08:38 PM
Follow-up after 2nd shot....could not sleep last night. HR was +5bpm over normal and I could not relax. Finally dozed off around 4:30 and when I woke up 2 hours later, I was slightly achy. Couple Tylenol took care of that, but I was wiped from being up all night.

Mostly laid around all day, with a few short naps. Feeling closer to normal now and expect to be normal tomorrow. Luckily this was a recovery week for me, so just an easy ride planned.

My reactions to my shingles vaccines were worse than this.....not a big deal.
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
longslowdistance

Posts:2886

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04/14/2021 08:45 PM
Agree about shingles - miserable! And tetanus boosters can be nasty, too.
longslowdistance

Posts:2886

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04/16/2021 09:33 PM
Latest on the J and J and AstraZ clot link, from a major poobah:
"The risk of thrombocytopenia and the risk of venous thromboembolism after vaccination against SARS-CoV-2 do not appear to be higher than the background risks in the general population, a finding consistent with the rare and sporadic nature of this syndrome"

So re open up the spigot and get shots in arms. So many vaccine doubters have hardened their positions based on this scary reporting. Which hurts us all.
79pmooney

Posts:3189

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04/16/2021 10:18 PM
Got my second a few hours ago. So far no issues. Can't even feel the shot. So I graduate as a 90%er in two weeks. And be eligible to step up and get my second shingles shot. Then pneumonia. My year of the needle. (Not really. 45 years ago I used to go in every two weeks to get stuck in each arm to donate platelets; back when they wanted everything they could get for research. Those were the big bicycle spoke needles. 15 and 14 gauge.)

I'll start doing more business in stores but plan to stick to the same mask and hand sanitizing/washing routines. (Funny, now that I am relatively safe, I have the really good masks and a sanitizer bottle that fits neatly in a shirt pocket - really handy!) And I've asked a woman at the farmer's market out for coffee after we are vaccinated. I'll have to wait for her. She might get hers late next month. I'll need to research a coffee place with a nice outdoors. I want to see this face I haven't seen unmasked for more than a year!
Cosmic Kid

Posts:4209

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04/17/2021 07:46 AM
Yeah, I have a nice supply of 3M N95 Aura masks and I am now fully vaxxed....but since I am also not changing my routine anytime soon (other than group rides), I’ll stil need ‘em.

Good luck on the date, Ben!!
Just say "NO!" to WCP!!!!
Orange Crush

Posts:4499

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04/17/2021 10:56 AM
Yes it’s important to stick to the established distancing and contact limiting habits, if only to serve as an example function, until population vaccination levels are at a sufficiently high percentage.

In BC we expect to have everyone receive their first shot by end of June at current pace so by summer should be able to relax measures somewhat. Second doses for everyone maybe by end of summer. The local team of experts continues to drill down into exposure numbers down the individual city and population group level for excellent adaptive management.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/dix-two-weeks-two-months-covid-2021-restrictions-april-1.5991727

longslowdistance

Posts:2886

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04/17/2021 06:58 PM
Thanks for that update. last I read for Canada was late Sept. Good news.
Potential bad news: the Brazil variant is here and may to some degree elude current vaccines. Or that's what the poobahs are chiming.
Orange Crush

Posts:4499

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04/17/2021 07:34 PM
Different parts of Canada could have different end dates as each province has their own strategy. P1 is now maybe dominant in BC and certainly it led to early Whistler closure. Variants are now 60% of overall cases here.

Looking at the daily case count in US it is on a gradual rise. A similar slow rise started here about a month and half ago which signaled variants starting to take over. So keep an eye on those numbers.
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